Option to turn off power calculation

The place to post what you would like to see added to Ascent

Option to turn off power calculation

Postby geerhead on Sun Mar 28, 2010 11:04 pm

Please add a preference to turn off the new power calculation. When there is no actual power meter data, Ascent now makes it up. I really do not want made up data in my training log & summary. I can edit each activity & manually turn off the power, but the new Ascent has gone backward & added power data to several years of training making this a big task. The power estimate is inaccurate & very much so for non cycling activity. It should be easy enough to add a preference to turn this feature off.

Awesome program & glad for every advance (except this one).
geerhead
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2007 10:00 am
Location: Boulder, CO

Re: Option to turn off power calculation

Postby ryan on Mon Mar 29, 2010 9:46 am

I echo that request!
User avatar
ryan
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 4:29 pm
Location: Dublin, Ireland

Re: Option to turn off power calculation

Postby MitusRider on Thu Apr 08, 2010 8:47 pm

+1. Estimated power is just nonsense. I'd rather have nothing than inaccurate figures. Please make this an option.
MitusRider
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 9:30 pm

Re: Option to turn off power calculation

Postby Mick F on Fri Apr 09, 2010 5:22 am

As a non-mathematician and someone who doesn't own a power meter, why are the power figures nonsense?

If Ascent knows your weight/age/size etc, and knows your equipment, it can work something out considering speed and gradient. After all, it can calculate the calorie consumption, so power can only be another way of looking at the figures.

Am I right, or talking nonsense?
Mick F. Cornwall
User avatar
Mick F
 
Posts: 242
Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2008 1:46 pm
Location: Tamar Valley, Cornwall

Re: Option to turn off power calculation

Postby MitusRider on Fri Apr 09, 2010 8:48 am

OK nonsense was wrong. But whilst the theory is sound (and works) in reality it's just not possible to get it as accurate as a real meter. The iBike power meter which is an indirect power meter, works on the mathematical principal and demonstrates that the maths is sound. However the iBike also captures a lot of enviromental data and needs calibration to work out friction, rider aerodynamics etc. So it takes quite a lot of calibration and isn't quite as accurate as a strain gauge meter (Direct Force) under all conditions.

You just can't know all the real inputs which constantly change. The first thing that strikes you when you get a power meter is how wildly numbers fluctuate. If it was so easy to model accurately why would power meters exist and people spend hundreds to thousands on them? I would rather have no data than inaccurate data, especially when the "good" data gets jumbled up with "bad" data. Calculated calories aren't great either. The only way to measure calories with more accuracy is with a power meter (Joules) and that's not perfect.

If you want these calculated numbers, that's fine by me. I'd just like it to be an option.
MitusRider
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 9:30 pm

Re: Option to turn off power calculation

Postby Mick F on Fri Apr 09, 2010 3:56 pm

Good points.
I wonder how far these figures are out? Is there a way of checking actual measurements against calculation?

On the software's side on this: what would the point be of designing software if it was way out in its results? Why bother?

As you can tell, I don't know many answers or have much of an opinion, I'm just curious.

Thanks for being patient,
Mick.
Mick F. Cornwall
User avatar
Mick F
 
Posts: 242
Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2008 1:46 pm
Location: Tamar Valley, Cornwall

Re: Option to turn off power calculation

Postby MitusRider on Fri Apr 09, 2010 4:47 pm

No problem, I look a good discussion and I'd be the first to admit I'm no expert.

The math models are correct, given perfect input. E.g a rider of known weight and surface area, who could hold a power constantly, on a consistent road surface (with known rolling resistance of drivetrain/tyres) with perfectly measured slope gradients and known wind resistance (and no drafting) the maths will work.

I've owned an iBike and Powertaps. The iBike when calibrated correctly (e.g. rider weight, frontal area and rolling resistance are set-up correctly through calibration) is extremely close to Powertap under good conditions riding solo. This device is fundamentally based on a maths formula constantly being computed, but also measures the slope accurately, wind resistance using a wind port etc. Now imagine taking away that knowledge of slope, wind and rolling resistance, frontal area knowledge and replacing it with estimates (or the best information Google maps or some weather station can deliver). It might be close, but then it might not be...and it will vary depending on the complexity of the ride and the environmental conditions. You just can't know.

The Powertap of course does away with all the guesswork/environmental factors by actually measuring the power output at the wheel.

Like I said, I'm no expert just a bike rider. There are whole discussion groups dedicated to this topic!

Cheers
MitusRider
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 9:30 pm

Re: Option to turn off power calculation

Postby oshloel on Mon May 03, 2010 2:04 am

Download version 1.11.1. There's a preference option to control the power calculation.
Rick
User avatar
oshloel
 
Posts: 281
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2007 7:34 pm
Location: Breckenridge, CO


Return to Feature Requests

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron